Quote by mkj1972Too many egos in the Chelski dressing room Fat Frank & JT control the dressing room.AVB did not stand a chance.May as well make JT manager
Incidentally John Terry is 20/1 to become the next manager.
Quote by mkj1972Too many egos in the Chelski dressing room Fat Frank & JT control the dressing room.AVB did not stand a chance.May as well make JT manager
If I was made sub whilst malouda or merieles took my place, I'd be heavily fucked off. And I'm 39, overweight and lacking a record that says I've scored double figures for 9 seasons in a row from midfield. So yes, I've every sympathy for Frank....
"The nightmares invading the sleep of Bayern fans involve four horsemen of the Champions League Apocalypse riding towards them. As the faces come into focus, they will recognise Frank Lampard, Cole, Petr Cech and Drogba. All were immense..."
Lot of people saying Terry, Lampard and Cole are the problem and Chelsea can't move forward untill they are gone. To me it seems they are vital for Chelsea to move forward, the Chelsea equivelent of Giggs, Scholes etc. Look closer to Malouda, Kalou, Torres and all the other shit in the squad. Luiz, Bosingwa, the list goes on.
Don't think AVB was ever going to succeed, how the fuck can a 34 year old manager with no experience managing in English football be expected to walk in that dressing room and tell players what to do?
Some very relevant and well made points on this thread so far. My take on it for what it's worth....
First of all it's very clear that Chelsea as a club, in its current guise, are lacking are great structure from top to bottom and there's a strong argument to say the club is a complete shambles.
But to deal with the AVB issue, solely - I can only say that the players come out of this looking very, very bad. I see JT getting a bit of a pasting here and elsewhere but I've never seen him give less than 100% for any manager , AVB included. Lampard is one of the biggest culprits. Chelsea legend, certainly - goalscoring freak of a midfielder sure. Team player? No so sure anymore. Man with many lackies in the media? Without doubt. He is the one Chelsea player who almost from the get go has been bleating like fuck to the the red tops and anyone else who cared to listen. Unfortunately for Frank many football fans are making the same points tonight and he has been exposed a little bit as someone who will throw the toys of the pram if he doesn't get his own way the whole time. Probably a bit symptomatic of modern day Premiership football but I'm disappointed by his attitude and behaviour nonetheless. Lampard is not the only culprit though - Malouda, Drogba and Cashley haven't exactly covered themselves in glory either. Add those attitudes that stink with the complete dross like Mereiles, Bosingwa, Kalou, a midfield that can neither run nor pass and a completely misfiring strike force and you begin to see why today was inevitable. Sad but inevitable.
It was a job too soon for AVB, he didn't help his cause with bizarre team selection, tactics etc but to see a man who impressed so much last season with Porto reduced to a shell after 256 days at Chelsea says more about the club and player than it does AVB.
I have no doubt he will learn from this and go on to achieve success elsewhere. Could well walk into the Inter job. Best of luck to him.
Quote by casualcolSome very relevant and well made points on this thread so far. My take on it for what it's worth....
First of all it's very clear that Chelsea as a club, in its current guise, are lacking are great structure from top to bottom and there's a strong argument to say the club is a complete shambles.
But to deal with the AVB issue, solely - I can only say that the players come out of this looking very, very bad. I see JT getting a bit of a pasting here and elsewhere but I've never seen him give less than 100% for any manager , AVB included. Lampard is one of the biggest culprits. Chelsea legend, certainly - goalscoring freak of a midfielder sure. Team player? No so sure anymore. Man with many lackies in the media? Without doubt. He is the one Chelsea player who almost from the get go has been bleating like fuck to the the red tops and anyone else who cared to listen. Unfortunately for Frank many football fans are making the same points tonight and he has been exposed a little bit as someone who will throw the toys of the pram if he doesn't get his own way the whole time. Probably a bit symptomatic of modern day Premiership football but I'm disappointed by his attitude and behaviour nonetheless. Lampard is not the only culprit though - Malouda, Drogba and Cashley haven't exactly covered themselves in glory either. Add those attitudes that stink with the complete dross like Mereiles, Bosingwa, Kalou, a midfield that can neither run nor pass and a completely misfiring strike force and you begin to see why today was inevitable. Sad but inevitable.
It was a job too soon for AVB, he didn't help his cause with bizarre team selection, tactics etc but to see a man who impressed so much last season with Porto reduced to a shell after 256 days at Chelsea says more about the club and player than it does AVB.
I have no doubt he will learn from this and go on to achieve success elsewhere. Could well walk into the Inter job. Best of luck to him.
Good post Colm and nice to see such honesty when deep down it must be hurting. Lampard has indeed been a disgrace with his constant veiled snipes at AVB through the press but this is what happens when the culture at the club results in the manager having little authority. Abramovich wields all the power at Chelsea and the senior players are well aware of the fact. I'm going to defend AVB with dropping certain players. If a player is openly disrespecting a manager then surely he (the manager) has the right to subsequently not pick him? Some would say he should have the power to move the said player out of the club! But at Chelsea that isn't the case it would seem.
I really believe AVB will be successful in the future but you are right in saying he wasn't ready at this stage of his career for the Chelsea job. He was doomed to failure from the very beginning and not because of his own inadequacies.
Frank dropped , sees likes of Mereiles picked in front of him .. right to be pissed off ? fucking right he has .. Legand ? highest ever goalscoring midfielder in the Premier League .. and from my view always gives his all all games .. But as for AVB , tactically got it wrong on too many occasions , never had the dressing room , and I think too in-experienced for such a daunting job .. If he was the future then he should have been given funds , fucked off the dross hanging around , and given a chance .. But way too many egos and big personalities to handle ..
The problems at Chelsea stem from the very very top, a Russian oligarch who probably does not really understand the game and cannot fathom why chucking millions of pounds at the club does not equate to success. Spoiled by a run of success under Mourinho and now any manager that cannot trump that is dismissed. His actions in getting rid of Ancelotti after two seasons (one of which produced a double) should have been writing on the wall for supporters.
Whoever comes in now has a huge job, the "project" that AVB kept referencing. He has 4-5 players that have served the club brilliantly but are to varying degress on their way out, another 4-5 big money players who are either not up to the job or don't want to be there. So another huge outlay needed by Abramovich, does he still have the appetite for it?
Complete overhaul basically, any manager not given time to do that is fucked and they are looking at a revolving door of managers in/out every 18-24 months.
I agree with Steve on this. as I said, if I was Lampard, I'd have been fuming. It's all very well getting rid of the old guard but to do it, you have to replace them with either a) better players b) younger lads who with development will be better players. Our alternatives were Malouda and Merieles. We got rid of Alex when our defence has been shit all season. Why? simply because of his age? the whole approach has been laughable from day one. You can't imagine Wenger walking into the Arsenal dressing room and alienating Adams, Dixon, etc...from day one just because they didn't fit with his age/style profile. If he had, his career at Arsenal would have been a lot different. He'd the sense to see they were needed until such times as they could be replaced by players at least as good. Indeed the same reason Fergie brought a 39 year old Scholes back in. Because he's still better at 39 than Anderson and the rest of those punters. And as for Lampard speaking to the press, AVB did it first with his response to the winner at Wolves when he refused point blank to praise Lampard for scoring the winner. That told everyone everything about the relationship so frank saying every is rosey to the press would be a nonsense.
If' he'd looked at half a dozen DVD's pre season, he'd have saw Bosingwa, Malouda, Kaloo and Mikel were never good enough - In fact, last seasons CL quarter final against Utd would have shown enough. Yet they've all played with regularity this season (Kaloo only stopping when even AVB worked out he's fucknig useless). The problem wasn't Lampard, Terry, Cole and Cech. The problems with the rest of the shit who were playing regularly.
"The nightmares invading the sleep of Bayern fans involve four horsemen of the Champions League Apocalypse riding towards them. As the faces come into focus, they will recognise Frank Lampard, Cole, Petr Cech and Drogba. All were immense..."
the problem they have is the manager is in awe of the big name players - and they should be respecting the manager's decisions. they dont have to like it but they shouldn't be acting up like a bunch of infants. which is basically what they've apparently been doing
agree with you there .. but this all stems back for Jose's days , where he bred it into the players to be winners , to never admit defeat - AVB having drawn against Fulham quoted that the league was over , has come out saying we can't compete with City .. eh ? we spent £75 million January 2011 ..
Until Abramovich realises that HE is the problem with his interfering and messing then nothing will change. He had the perfect manager in Mourhino who could have dominated Europe for years IMO but couldn't even leave him alone and he ended up walking away. Look at United. Parasitic owners who are haemorrhaging money out of the club but on the football side they are shrewd enough to stay well clear and let Fergie run the club. You only need to look at what Abramovich did to Ancelotti to understand what a fucking idiot he is.
couldn't agree more .. and I hope Mourinho returns , but returns to total control .. it's getting really silly now , AVB was groomed as the future , build a young team , with exciting football ... £25 million now completely wasted ..
but it's his money , and seems he completely calls the shots ..
Quote by VasqueUntil Abramovich realises that HE is the problem with his interfering and messing then nothing will change. He had the perfect manager in Mourhino who could have dominated Europe for years IMO but couldn't even leave him alone and he ended up walking away. Look at United. Parasitic owners who are haemorrhaging money out of the club but on the football side they are shrewd enough to stay well clear and let Fergie run the club. You only need to look at what Abramovich did to Ancelotti to understand what a fucking idiot he is.
now that, I do agree with.....I've been wrestling with this one since AVB got the bullet. On one hand, you've a guy who puts a billion into the club, new training facilities, youth academy, heavy player investment, basically top dollar on everything. On the other hand, he interferes, has unrealistic expectations, surrounds himself with numpties and yes men, none of which have the metal to tell him the truth and has generally contributed to the departure of every manager we've had bar Hiddink.
unfortunately for Ancellotti, the truth only really emerged in his recent interview about last season - told to sell after winning the double, told youth was the way forward, then had 75million worth of players thrown at him in January. and that's only skimming the surface. We'll keep going through managers good and bad unless the interference changes.....
"The nightmares invading the sleep of Bayern fans involve four horsemen of the Champions League Apocalypse riding towards them. As the faces come into focus, they will recognise Frank Lampard, Cole, Petr Cech and Drogba. All were immense..."
Quote by VasqueUntil Abramovich realises that HE is the problem with his interfering and messing then nothing will change. He had the perfect manager in Mourhino who could have dominated Europe for years IMO but couldn't even leave him alone and he ended up walking away. Look at United. Parasitic owners who are haemorrhaging money out of the club but on the football side they are shrewd enough to stay well clear and let Fergie run the club. You only need to look at what Abramovich did to Ancelotti to understand what a fucking idiot he is.
now that, I do agree with.....I've been wrestling with this one since AVB got the bullet. On one hand, you've a guy who puts a billion into the club, new training facilities, youth academy, heavy player investment, basically top dollar on everything. On the other hand, he interferes, has unrealistic expectations, surrounds himself with numpties and yes men, none of which have the metal to tell him the truth and has generally contributed to the departure of every manager we've had bar Hiddink.
unfortunately for Ancellotti, the truth only really emerged in his recent interview about last season - told to sell after winning the double, told youth was the way forward, then had 75million worth of players thrown at him in January. and that's only skimming the surface. We'll keep going through managers good and bad unless the interference changes.....
It just makes you wonder mate what Mourhino could have done given free reign at the club. You've had great success since Abramovich arrived but it's frightening to think how much more you could have had. All that money wasted on hiring and firing managers, he should just have given it all to Mourhino to spend on the squad. Jose + £££'s = guaranteed success.
Quote by VasqueUntil Abramovich realises that HE is the problem with his interfering and messing then nothing will change. He had the perfect manager in Mourhino who could have dominated Europe for years IMO but couldn't even leave him alone and he ended up walking away. Look at United. Parasitic owners who are haemorrhaging money out of the club but on the football side they are shrewd enough to stay well clear and let Fergie run the club. You only need to look at what Abramovich did to Ancelotti to understand what a fucking idiot he is.
now that, I do agree with.....I've been wrestling with this one since AVB got the bullet. On one hand, you've a guy who puts a billion into the club, new training facilities, youth academy, heavy player investment, basically top dollar on everything. On the other hand, he interferes, has unrealistic expectations, surrounds himself with numpties and yes men, none of which have the metal to tell him the truth and has generally contributed to the departure of every manager we've had bar Hiddink.
unfortunately for Ancellotti, the truth only really emerged in his recent interview about last season - told to sell after winning the double, told youth was the way forward, then had 75million worth of players thrown at him in January. and that's only skimming the surface. We'll keep going through managers good and bad unless the interference changes.....
It just makes you wonder mate what Mourhino could have done given free reign at the club. You've had great success since Abramovich arrived but it's frightening to think how much more you could have had. All that money wasted on hiring and firing managers, he should just have given it all to Mourhino to spend on the squad. Jose + £££'s = guaranteed success.
yep, you tend to think there's a decent chance we'd have a Champions League under the belt too. there's an article in the mail today about AVB and basically the ruskie coming to him the day before the game against yous when he starting asking for tactics, who would be playing, etc.... I mean, FFS. He didn't help himself at times but I did have sympathy for AVB. if seasoned names like Scolari and Ancellotti struggled with the 'hands on' owner, what must AVB have felt.
Would be just like Mourinho to add another CL win this season too. I hope he comes back but I've a nagging doubt he will - not least because he won't get the control he wants. Pity, because I long again for the days of Fortress SB and knowing the opposition were a goal down when the saw Mourinhos press conference the day before
"The nightmares invading the sleep of Bayern fans involve four horsemen of the Champions League Apocalypse riding towards them. As the faces come into focus, they will recognise Frank Lampard, Cole, Petr Cech and Drogba. All were immense..."
I get what Steve says with regards to Lampard being angry at being dropped etc, but that isn't the point. You'd expect him to be angry. But you'd also expect him to work his arse off to get back into the team rather than acting childish over the matter. If your boss at work tells you to step it up, you do it. You may not agree but you do it.
but how hasn't he ? I never saw him on TV critisising AVB , when he came on he would score , he came off he seemed ok coming off .. so how has he conducted himself badly ? hearsay ? or you have actual proof of discerning comments he's made ?
Quote by SpenceI get what Steve says with regards to Lampard being angry at being dropped etc, but that isn't the point. You'd expect him to be angry. But you'd also expect him to work his arse off to get back into the team rather than acting childish over the matter. If your boss at work tells you to step it up, you do it. You may not agree but you do it.
Not forgetting that we don't know why Lampard was dropped. I understand he's a Chelsea legend but Roy Keane was a legend at United but once he crossed the manager he was shown the door. So were Stam and van Nistleroy.
Quote by STEVECFCbut how hasn't he ? I never saw him on TV critisising AVB , when he came on he would score , he came off he seemed ok coming off .. so how has he conducted himself badly ? hearsay ? or you have actual proof of discerning comments he's made ?
You're seriously saying his body language and the way he phrased things in interviews didn't appear a little childish?
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